Newsgroups: talk.religion.misc
Subject: Re: Nature of God/Trinity-B (was Re: Mormons are not Christians)
References: <1992Oct19.143821.7561@infonode.ingr.com> <1992Oct22.000214.3677@pslu1.psl.wisc.edu> <1992Oct22.153554.9431@infonode.ingr.com>

tensmekl@infonode.ingr.com (Kermit Tensmeyer) writes:

>In article <1992Oct22.000214.3677@pslu1.psl.wisc.edu> johnson@whitewater.chem.wisc.edu (Art Johnson) writes:

> My understanding is that Logos is a concept from Hellinic Culture, that
> John appropriated to explain his vision of Jesus on the right hand of God.

> What was the original concept of Logos and how does this concept alter
> the vision of what God is/can be?

A number of sources have been suggested for the concept of Logos in
John.  Note that the source doesn't entirely explain how it's used in
John, as I'll comment.  Brown's commentary in the Anchor Bible lists
the following possible sources:

A Hellenistic
  1 Heraclitus: logos as the eternal principle of order
  2 Stoics: logos was the mind of God
  3 Philo (a Jewish philosopher with Hellenistic background):
	logos was intermediary between God and has creatures.
	Gave meaning to the universe.  Almost a second God
  4 Hermetic lit, expression of mind of God, but this is later
  5 Mandean liturgies have word of life, etc., but this may be
	influenced by Christians
  6 Gnosticism, but Valentinians were probably based on John
B Jewish
  1 prophetic Word of the Lord, and the Word active in creation
  2 personified wisdom: from Philo, Sirach, etc.  The Word was
	the agent of creation
  3 Jewish speculation on the Law: The Law is pictured as having
	been created before all things and having served as the
	pattern for creation.
  4 Targumic use of Memra (Aramaic for Word): Memra is surrogate
	for God himself.  This is not personification, but the
	use of Memra serves as a buffer for divine transcendence.

Brown concludes that the closest parallels are in the Jewish
background.  Note particularly that John 1 is clearly intended to
remind us of Gen 1.  Frankly I think it's hard to completely separate
these influences.  By the 1st Cent, Judaism had already been
influenced by Hellenistic thought, particularly through Philo.  So I'm
sure Hellenistic uses were in people's minds.  But there is also ample
OT background, including the creative word in the creation story, the
prophetic word, and the wisdom literature.  I would say that this
background interacted with uses of Logos in Hellenistic philosophy to
produce images with a large variety of implications.

As Brown points out, John is starting with preexisting imagery, but
uses it for his own specific purposes.  "The description of the Word
with God in heaven before creation is remarkably brief; there is not
the slightest indication of interest in metaphysical speculations ...
The Prolog is a description of the history of salvation in hymnic form
.. Therefore, the emphasis is on God's relation to men, rather than on
God in Himself.  The very title "Word" implies a revelation -- not so
much a divine idea, but a divine communication." As he points out
elsewhere, none of the sources have any concept of the Logos becoming
flesh.  So John has taken a term with a remarkably rich history and
set of implications, but used it in his own way.